DIALOGUE AT THE UNITED NATIONS BETWEEN SANT DARSHAN SINGH AND DR. ROBERT MULLER  (excerpt)

Dr. Robert Muller is the Chancellor of the University for Peace and Past Assistant Secretary-General of the United Nations. Sant Darshan Singh is the spiritual head of Sawan Kirpal Ruhani Mission and President of the World Fellowship of Religions. Their meeting took place on July 11, 1986, at the United Nations.

Dr. Muller: I welcome you to the United Nations. To a great sage like you, I am happy to report that there is now a growing consciousness around the world that we are one world and one human family.

Sant Darshan Singh: Yes, that is right. The saints speak of it as the Fatherhood of God and the brotherhood of man.

Dr. Muller: The belief in the divine law has yet to develop more fully. But the belief in one world, an interdependent world, has made very great progress in the last few years.

Sant Darshan Singh: Indeed, all of humanity is linked together. One of my own verses is:

"What does it matter if l am called a man?

In truth, I am the very soul of love;

The entire earth is my home,

And the universe my country."

Dr. Muller: Yes. Absolutely. The most important road to this realization is education. The children are not being educated into one world. They are being educated into one country, into onereligion, into one culture, into one language. In the world today this is no longer correct. They are entitled to the vision expressed in your verse. We must give them a picture of the universe and all the world as being their home.

Sant Darshan Singh: Now, we have become interplanetary people. We are no longer earth-earthy people. Ultimately, we have to become cosmic people.

Dr. Muller: On the whole the people of this earth are becoming a little more peaceful, a little more understanding than ever before. The hatred is not quite so deep as it was in the past. When I was a little boy in Alsace-Lorraine I was not even allowed to cross the border, because on the other side there were Germans. Today Germany and France are very friendly with each other. The people intermarry. They visit both sides of the border. The leaders meet very frequently. Hopefully some day the Soviets and the Americans will do the same. They should see and talk to each other and get to know each other.

Sant Darshan Singh: The same conditions were prevalent among leaders of religions. The heads of two religions would not come together. It was our Beloved Master, Sant Kirpal Singh, who organized the World Fellowship of Religions and held four conferences in India. It was the first time that the leaders of all religions shared the same platform. There were Protestants and Roman Catholics from among the Christians; Shias and Sunnis from among the Muslims; Arya Samajis and the Sanatanis from the Hindus; there were Buddhists; Jains; Sikhs; Zoroastrians; Jews; and representatives from other religions as well. When each spoke of his or her own religion we found that the quintessence of the teachings of all the saints and scriptures was the same. We can epitomize these as non-violence, truthfulness, chastity, humility, and selfless service.

Dr. Muller: Let me show you something which is quite in line with what you have just said. [Opens a booklet.] Here is a school which is teaching the children to be world citizens. [The School of Ageless Wisdom, renamed the Robert Muller School, 6005 Royal Oak Drive, Arlington, Texas 76016]. This is an exercise which the children do. They answer such questions like "Where am I?" They begin with the universe, then galaxy, solar system, planet, hemisphere, continent, country, state, city, street, name, and then they draw a picture of their home. So right away the children are placed straight into their universe. Usually in schools they are taught this only progressively. But here, they are told right away so that they understand their relationship to the universe, and to the earth which is their home, and to humanity which is their family. It is like acquainting a child with his house, from the attic to the cellar, and with his brothers and sisters.

Sant Darshan Singh: This is a part of what we call positive mysticism.

Dr. Muller: Positive mysticism?

Sant Darshan Singh: Yes. On my first tour in 1978 I made a distinction between "positive mysticism" and "negative mysticism." Some of those from the Western world have said that the Indian system of mysticism required people to leave their hearths and homes, go into the icy caves of the Himalayas or the thatched huts of the desert, and spend their life there. And they rightly said that such an approach was a path of escapism, which did not make good citizens. I agree that that approach to mysticism is misguided and can lead to a path of negative mysticism. We do not believe either in renunciation or in asceticism. We owe our obligation to our parents, to our family, to our society, and to our nation. Further, we have to fulfill our obligations at the international and the cosmic levels. We should discharge all of them in the best possible way. But while doing so we should always keep an eye on the be-all and end-all of human life which is self-knowledge and God-realization. We believe in having the best of both worlds. That is what I call positive mysticism.

Dr. Muller: Well, you have two illustrations of this in the United Nations. Secretary-General U Thant was a Buddhist. He always said that humans should have multiple allegiances: to oneself, to the family, to the culture, to the nation, to humanity, to the world, and to the universe. The second illustration was Dag Hammarskjold who became a mystic in the United Nations. He also said that in our time the road to sanctity went through the world of action. In other words, you should not separate action from mysticism. There should be mysticism in action. And since this is a complex world, there is need for a complex citizenship. People should be as readily involved in world affairs as they are in national affairs.

Sant Darshan Singh: Rightly understood, true mysticism leads to constructive action. Mysticism and action go together.

Dr. Muller: Here in the United Nations, we live this on a daily basis. Anyone who comes to work in this international house, whether the Secretary-General or others, has to ask himself or herself what life is all about. Why are we here? Why are we floating in the universe? What is this planet? Who are we in the cosmos? What are we supposed to achieve? The United Nations is really the point on the world level where everything converges. Here you find diplomats, sociologists, economists, atomic scientists, and also sages and religious leaders. This is why two popes came here. It is a most incredible place. For the first time, the whole of humanity is working together to try to work out this universal philosophy of life, this new spirituality. And sometimes we succeed. For example, the Universal Declaration of Human Rights is a great philosophy, and it was produced by committees. It is miraculous.

Sant Darshan Singh: I have read your book, New Genesis, and there you have described this concept so beautifully.

Dr. Muller: Alas, I am not a philosopher or a sage; I am simply an observer.

Sant Darshan Singh: But you are a philosopher because you are thinking of reality and are trying to put reality into practice. In your book, you speak of the power of "interiority." On this present tour I have coined a word which describes that power. I call it "soulergy," which I spell as s-o-u-l-e-r-g-y, because it refers to the power of the soul. I also call it "innergy," which I spell as i-n-n-e-r-g-y, because we contact the power within. It is by transforming our own lives that we transform the world. By contacting soulergy or innergy, the divine power within, we bring about a profound metamorphosis. This innergy is like a high-pressure basin of water waiting to be tapped. If we sink a well into it, its divine waters will gush forth. Then, the arid desert of our lives will blossom into an oasis, and our strife-torn world will become a veritable heaven on earth.

Dr. Muller: If we could have soul energy in addition to solar energy that would be quite a sum total! There is a soul energy, no doubt.

Sant Darshan Singh: Your book talks about the spiritual awakening in the world. To be an optimist at this critical juncture is a very great thing. Saints are always prophets of hope. They are never prophets of doom. So we believe in being prophets of hope.